I Put a Gun to My Head Then God Interrupted | Eric Stephens | 063

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Hey everybody, it's Mick
Weinholt, host of When You Look.

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There's a lot of incredible
insight and meaningful

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conversation in this episode,
but some of the topics we

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discuss may not be suitable for
younger listeners.

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Wanted to give you that heads up
going in.

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Ready.
Let's go.

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So at that point, the scene felt
like such a heavyweight and

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heavy failure that it was like,
I'm just going to end this and

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like I'm I'm done.
But what's crazy is at that .1

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of the pastors in the church had
called me to talk to me about

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some stuff that I had already
been discussing with him and I

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wanted to change all my life.
And I tell you, he was letting

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me have it in that moment.
But he didn't know there was a

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gun in my head of town.
He had no clue.

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Welcome to When You Look, where
ordinary people share their

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extraordinary experiences and
you get to decide, was it

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coincidence or God?
Eric, welcome to When You Look,

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man.
So great to have you on the

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show.
Matt, I feel like it's been

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weeks since we talked last.
Yeah, it was great to be on your

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show rooted in Christ and
genuine pleasure to have you

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here on when you look for sure,
because you got a a wonderful

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story that God has written
through your life.

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And we're going to get to that
in a moment.

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But before we do introduce
yourself, tell us a little bit

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about you.
Matt, thank you for having me

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on.
I really, I really appreciate

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it, Matt.
Yeah, it's follower Christ,

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husband, father, pastor and
elder my church, host of the

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Rooting Christ podcast, founder
of the Beyond the Walls concert

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series here in Cleveland, OH.
We're changing it to beyond the

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walls movement, though, because
we're we got plans coming up for

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26 and 27.
So and I kicked off a nonprofit,

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Redwood Christian Ministries and
my wife and I have our Redwood

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Christian creative.
So yeah, we're, we're staying

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busy for the Kingdom, man.
She's a talented winner.

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Oh, she's got, she's teaching
voice and piano lessons right

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now.
So I'm just, I'm just a

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mouthpiece right now.
Putting putting it all out

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there.
Roger that, man.

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Well, it's great to get that
little bit of background on you.

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Give us a little bit of back
story here as we jump into

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things and then walk us through
things as they went down for

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you.
I was bad man like I'm lucky to

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even be sitting here talking to
you, man.

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It was crazy.
I, I'm so like my, my life is

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what I is, is simply what I tell
people is like, I'm lucky to, to

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be alive and I was going to take
my own life.

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And I'm, I've jumped so far
ahead in my story, but This is

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why I literally from start to
finish, I encourage people to

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follow Jesus.
There's two people you're going

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to hear on this microphone
today.

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And I hope that if you get
anything else out of this, you

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get nothing else out of this.
Follow Christ because that's the

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very thing you're missing.
It's not these microphones, it's

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not these lights, it's not
whatever you know, it's not the

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successor or the, or even the
failure.

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You're going to hear through
these stories.

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It's, it's Jesus.
So they turn this off right now.

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I hope that it's they are closer
to him than what they were when

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they turned it on.
Yeah, Amen.

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And when I tell you lucky, I
mean, I had a car accident I

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shouldn't have walked away from.
I mean, I had my own 9mm to my

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head and I, I thank God I didn't
unlock myself at that point.

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I had 11 or 12 guys waiting for
me outside of a nightclub once.

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Like, so when I tell you like
Jesus has done a miracle work in

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my life and I'm lucky to be
sitting here.

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No, I'm blessed to be sitting
here because it was his ordained

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plan and purpose for my life,
you know, and just remembering

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God knows the beginning from the
end.

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So he knew he knew we'd be here.
So growing up, you know, I, I

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grew up with with be pretty much
being raised my mom and and my

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grandmother and part I was going
to a Catholic school for most of

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of my life.
When my mom got married, I was

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about 5th or 6th grade.
Stop, I'm going to Catholic

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school in a Baptist Church
office.

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So I got, I got Mass on Fridays
and I got Baptist Church on

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Sundays.
You think this would have kept

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me boxed in?
Instead, it just added the fact

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like I'm ready to to rebel and,
and just go do what I want to

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do.
But man, I had one of those

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those pivotal moments.
I think a number of of men have

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had them that, you know, my
biological father was not really

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a part of my life.
I want to be very clear,

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separating my stepfather from my
biological father.

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My biological father was not a
part of my life, not not too

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much.
And my last interaction with him

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was my 11th or 12th birthday.
You know, he was fresh out of

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the military.
He's 6 foot three.

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He's got like 5% body fat.
We go up to Woodhill Park in

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Cleveland to go play basketball.
And I'm just some short, chubby

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round kid at this point in time.
Like, I probably looked like the

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basketball that we were getting
ready to use.

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And, you know, he, I remember he
went for a jump shot.

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He missed a shot at going for a
rebound.

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He he fouled me so hard that
this wasn't like one of those

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like, hey, I'm trying to toughen
you up, get you ready.

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It was like, bro, this is
unnecessary, you know what I

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mean?
Like you're like, thanks, dad.

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And I'm crying on the
playground.

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And then I remember he just
like, he tore me down.

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He's like, you're not going to
be like me.

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You're not going to get girls
like me.

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You're not going to make money
like me.

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Like you're not tough.
You don't have muscles like what

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is going on with you?
And I'm just like, wow, all

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right.
And that that was one of those

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breaking points because, you
know, kids this we're talking

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about kids in in the 80s and
early 90s, like kids are mean

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now.
We were mean then.

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Like the, the kids who went
home, who had to go home by St.

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lights.
We were mean then, OK, Like

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there wasn't any, you know, you
didn't talk about like

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therapists growing up in the
ghetto or, or going to get like,

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like the mental health wasn't
like a, a thing, you know, it

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was like you just got to tough
it out.

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So I was already getting picked
on at school a little bit.

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That didn't add that added to
it, you know, and then I'm, I'm,

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I'm sandwiched between these two
religious things and I'm like,

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you know what, I've, I've had
enough.

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I'm, I'm done.
I said by the time I got ready

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to get out of high school, I
said, I'm done getting picked

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on.
And people always laugh when I

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say it.
But I grew up watching pro

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wrestling and I grew up in the
80s and then we had those

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largest in life movie
characters.

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And I said, you know what?
I'm going to create a I'm just

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going to morph myself into being
what people want me to be.

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The tiger getting pushed around,
tiger getting picked on.

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Except I'm going to write myself
into my story and be the villain

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of my own story because I said
the bad guys get cheered.

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They got everything that the
world says I want.

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They got money, they got the
alcohol, they got the drugs,

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they got the girls.
We can go, let's just go out and

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live this life.
Every rapper I listen to is

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rapping about it.
Every R&B song is singing about

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it.
Everything I see on TV is

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talking about it.
Being good doesn't pay in this

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world.
I'm going to go be that guy.

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And it was it just you think you
are doing something that is

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healthy at that point And it's
like, no.

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It led to every single issue
that I had.

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It just dug me deeper and deeper
and deeper into into losing

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myself, you know, so.
So what was what was that like

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in terms of how did the rubber
really meet the road when you

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really set down that path of
being the quote UN quote, bad

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boy, bad guy kind of scenario?
Same will always keep you longer

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than you want to stay there.
And it's always going to cost

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you more than than you expect,
like always.

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And you may start out with a
little bit and then before you

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know it like you're all the way
in left field somewhere.

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You know, the, the I don't
believe the enemy puts all the

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chains on us all at once.
You know, I think that some of

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those, those deep rooted things
I just get put on you link by

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link by link by link, because
this is, oh, this is so much

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fun.
Oh, this looks so easy.

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The rubber really met the role.
My grandmother had her second

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bout with with cancer.
That was when it really, it

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really hit short of being cancer
once.

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And my mom called me one day and
she said, you know, your, your,

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your, your grandmother has
cancer again.

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And it's, it's, it's bladder
cancer.

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And it seems to be progressing
fairly, fairly quickly at at

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this point.
And quickly at that point.

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I probably was, it was a few
months before she had actually

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passed, but I had started
attending a church in the

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college town I was in called New
Beginnings.

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And I end up getting a job in
Cleveland.

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So I moved to Lakewood, OH, and
I said, all right, well, we

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found a church out there.
Might as well try to find one,

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find one here.
Visited there once, didn't go

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the next week.
But in the middle of of that, I

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got a phone call from my mom
saying, hey, your grandmother

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has about three to five days to
live.

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And that's coming from Hospice.
Based off some of the symptoms

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she's showing cancer, you know,
some of the stuff she's showing

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that that's about the time they
give her.

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And you got to understand at
this point, I had been drinking

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whiskey through a straw.
I understand.

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Like it's, I'm not bragging
either.

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It's like I could shoot whiskey
with the best of them and it's

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for all the wrong reasons.
I'm, I'm buying weed by the

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ounce at this point now.
So started off as a, as a small

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like dime is now growing up into
a zip lock bag full of drugs.

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Anybody wants to tell you weeds
on a drug, you're dead wrong.

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Like it's, it's, it completely
altered everything I was doing

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was altering my mind.
I was not processing my feelings

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and emotions the way that that,
you know, I, I really should

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have been in any kind of healthy
mindset.

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I remember getting that phone
call from my mom and just

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sitting still.
I got a phone call from another

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family member shortly after that
that then told me, I don't know

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who started this rumor, but your
grandmother's going to live.

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She's going to be fine.
And now my head is absolutely

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spinning because I want my hero
to sit back up.

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I want, I want her to live.
I want her to keep going.

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You know, I got my at a time in
my head, I'm like, I got my work

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ethic from her.
You know, she grew up, you know,

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having ten kids working 2 jobs
in in the era she grew up in.

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No, you want to be black and be
a woman.

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That was not like didn't hear
her make any excuses.

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No excuse for the situation, no
excuse for the circumstances.

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She just would just grind it
out.

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OK.
And now I'm I just sat perfectly

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still and I said, man, this is
the heaviest thing.

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I hadn't felt so much heaviness
and so much confusion in my life

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because while my mom lied to me
about her mother dying, but I

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want my mom to be wrong.
I want this other person to be

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right.
That's what I'm that's what I'm

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gunning for.
But I'm sitting there on my bed

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and like, you know what, I'm
just going to pray.

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I'm just going to pray.
And anybody who lives in

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Lakewood, they you can hear the
trains go by, especially

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depending on where you're at.
They become white noise to you

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because you hear them all the
time.

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You hear them every day.
You don't even, you don't even

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think about it.
I start praying and I said, God,

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if you are real, I will follow
you.

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But I need to know if my
grandmother is going to live or

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die.
I need to know if she's going to

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live or die right after.
I, I mean, it was instant when I

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00:11:01,400 --> 00:11:04,880
got done with that prayer, the
train that I hear every day went

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by and it blew his horn so loud
three times I jumped out of my

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00:11:10,400 --> 00:11:11,720
skin.
I mean, when I heard that train

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go by, I mean, I literally it,
it, it should not have been.

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00:11:16,920 --> 00:11:19,160
It might as well have been like
a bomb going off in my

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00:11:19,160 --> 00:11:23,520
apartment.
And I said, OK, she's going to

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00:11:23,520 --> 00:11:26,520
pass away in three days.
Wow.

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Saturday morning, 6:00 AM, first
thing she was gone.

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Next thing that happens, the
head pastor, the church, New

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00:11:34,960 --> 00:11:37,920
Life Church, who met me one
time, he called me and he said,

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00:11:37,920 --> 00:11:40,440
or he texted me and he said,
hey, I noticed you weren't at

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00:11:40,440 --> 00:11:42,400
church.
So this this would have been the

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00:11:42,400 --> 00:11:43,560
next, this would have been the
next day.

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00:11:43,560 --> 00:11:46,240
So this will be the Sunday he
texted me and he said, I noticed

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00:11:46,240 --> 00:11:48,920
you weren't at church.
Just want to check in on you to

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00:11:48,920 --> 00:11:52,560
make sure everything's OK.
So the shepherd knew one of his

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00:11:52,560 --> 00:11:54,920
sheep we had met once was
already missing.

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00:11:56,040 --> 00:11:59,200
So that was for me.
My that was like my main wake up

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00:11:59,200 --> 00:12:01,680
call.
Where does all of this with your

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00:12:01,680 --> 00:12:07,520
grandmother fit in with some of
the stuff that you've already

242
00:12:07,520 --> 00:12:10,720
mentioned right at the outset
about, you know, lots of

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00:12:10,720 --> 00:12:12,600
drinking, lots of drugs, that
type of thing.

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00:12:12,600 --> 00:12:17,200
But then also you having your
own 9mm, give us a sense for

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00:12:17,200 --> 00:12:20,880
where where that all lines up
and the guys at the club and all

246
00:12:20,880 --> 00:12:22,000
that.
Yeah, yeah.

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00:12:22,000 --> 00:12:24,920
She, my grandmother was my, my,
my hero man.

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00:12:24,920 --> 00:12:27,360
Like I looked up to her, you
know, and I can say it now, but

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00:12:27,360 --> 00:12:29,800
she had a part of my heart that
God was supposed to have.

250
00:12:30,680 --> 00:12:33,480
It's tough when you talk about
idolatry in the sense of a

251
00:12:33,480 --> 00:12:35,440
family member that you were that
close to.

252
00:12:36,280 --> 00:12:39,560
But she had a part of my heart
like Jesus needed.

253
00:12:39,560 --> 00:12:43,560
And it wasn't until she passed
away that I, I legitimate and it

254
00:12:43,560 --> 00:12:46,240
even after she passed, it took
me years to even come to that.

255
00:12:46,240 --> 00:12:52,560
That realization for me, what
ended up happening was I, I, the

256
00:12:52,560 --> 00:12:55,000
my, my, my stands were still too
readily available.

257
00:12:55,080 --> 00:13:00,080
I got saved and I backslid.
But there's an awareness going

258
00:13:00,080 --> 00:13:01,800
on now.
I'm not happy with what I'm

259
00:13:01,800 --> 00:13:03,920
doing.
It was conviction at that time,

260
00:13:04,720 --> 00:13:08,960
you know, that's what.
And so sin didn't feel the same.

261
00:13:09,640 --> 00:13:12,040
The stuff didn't taste the same.
It didn't look the same.

262
00:13:12,080 --> 00:13:14,360
I was, it was literally at that
point it wasn't, it was, there

263
00:13:14,360 --> 00:13:17,920
was addictions I just had to
beat and it was all rooted in

264
00:13:17,920 --> 00:13:21,200
rejection.
So at that point, the sin felt

265
00:13:21,200 --> 00:13:25,560
like such a heavyweight and
heavy failure that it was like,

266
00:13:25,560 --> 00:13:27,840
I'm just going to end this.
I'm like, I'm, I'm done.

267
00:13:27,840 --> 00:13:30,360
But what's crazy is at that .1
of the pastors from the church

268
00:13:30,360 --> 00:13:32,800
had called me to talk to me
about some stuff that I had

269
00:13:32,800 --> 00:13:34,080
already been discussing with
him.

270
00:13:34,080 --> 00:13:35,160
And I wanted to change all my
life.

271
00:13:35,840 --> 00:13:39,160
And I tell you, he was letting
me have it in that moment, but

272
00:13:39,160 --> 00:13:40,960
he didn't know there was a gun
in my head at the time.

273
00:13:40,960 --> 00:13:43,560
He had no clue.
And I saw him maybe like a week

274
00:13:43,560 --> 00:13:47,000
or two after that.
And I said, hey, I just want to

275
00:13:47,000 --> 00:13:48,120
tell you thank you.
He was like, why?

276
00:13:48,120 --> 00:13:51,400
I said you gave me the very
thing I needed to hear.

277
00:13:52,160 --> 00:13:55,840
And I told him about like I had
a gun to my head, like loaded

278
00:13:55,840 --> 00:13:59,320
ready to go.
And he grabbed me like he had he

279
00:13:59,320 --> 00:14:01,360
had massive hands.
Like, you know, he had these

280
00:14:01,360 --> 00:14:02,400
you.
So when he grabbed me, there was

281
00:14:02,400 --> 00:14:06,600
no to be clear, I'm 61220.
So when I tell you this man had

282
00:14:06,600 --> 00:14:09,160
massive hands, I'm trying to put
this in perspective when I tell

283
00:14:09,160 --> 00:14:15,240
you I couldn't go anywhere.
So he was like, why didn't you

284
00:14:15,240 --> 00:14:16,680
tell me?
And I'm like, OK, first, please

285
00:14:16,680 --> 00:14:17,520
stop shaking me.
OK?

286
00:14:19,200 --> 00:14:23,280
Please, I'm begging you.
But I I told him I said no.

287
00:14:23,280 --> 00:14:25,760
I if I would have told you that
the message might have not been

288
00:14:25,760 --> 00:14:28,160
delivered the way it it needed
to be.

289
00:14:28,480 --> 00:14:31,920
Hey, it's Mick real quick before
we keep going, if this

290
00:14:31,920 --> 00:14:35,240
conversation is meaningful for
you, do me a favor.

291
00:14:35,520 --> 00:14:39,120
Tap subscribe so you don't miss
the awesome stuff coming next.

292
00:14:39,400 --> 00:14:42,280
And if you've gotten even one
insight from this episode,

293
00:14:42,320 --> 00:14:45,760
please hit the like button.
It's a small thing, but it helps

294
00:14:45,760 --> 00:14:47,800
this reach more people who might
need it.

295
00:14:48,360 --> 00:14:51,760
Last thing, think of one person
in your life who would benefit

296
00:14:51,760 --> 00:14:52,840
from this.
Just one.

297
00:14:53,280 --> 00:14:57,320
Share it with them right now.
That's how this grows, person to

298
00:14:57,320 --> 00:14:59,560
person.
All right, back to it.

299
00:15:00,280 --> 00:15:02,360
The guys outside of the club
that happened in college before

300
00:15:02,360 --> 00:15:03,800
I hadn't even gotten to all this
point.

301
00:15:03,800 --> 00:15:06,160
I was giving you an overview of
just like how bad things were

302
00:15:06,160 --> 00:15:08,960
really getting, you know,
before, before Christ.

303
00:15:09,240 --> 00:15:12,600
But that's where the whole like
suicide attempt and everything

304
00:15:12,600 --> 00:15:14,880
was was that.
And that's how and God sent him

305
00:15:14,960 --> 00:15:17,960
at the right time, you know, and
it just shows he has a plan and

306
00:15:17,960 --> 00:15:19,760
a purpose.
And if it's not your time, it's

307
00:15:19,760 --> 00:15:21,880
not your time.
You may have to go through some

308
00:15:21,880 --> 00:15:23,680
stuff, you have to deal with
some things, but if it's not

309
00:15:23,680 --> 00:15:25,080
your time to go, it's not going
to be your time.

310
00:15:26,240 --> 00:15:28,520
Yeah, OK.
We're definitely going to

311
00:15:28,520 --> 00:15:36,160
explore this a little bit more.
When when did you get saved

312
00:15:36,680 --> 00:15:39,240
relative to your grandmother
passing?

313
00:15:41,040 --> 00:15:45,880
That would have been she would
have passed away I believe May

314
00:15:45,880 --> 00:15:49,080
of 2010 and I got saved in
August of 2010.

315
00:15:50,640 --> 00:15:54,560
OK, so not that many months
after she passes, you're

316
00:15:54,560 --> 00:16:00,600
obviously dealing with the
grief, her loss, your loss of

317
00:16:00,600 --> 00:16:05,440
her, all of that.
What then brings you to the

318
00:16:05,440 --> 00:16:11,440
point of confessing Christ,
confessing sin, recognizing that

319
00:16:11,440 --> 00:16:13,760
you needed a Savior, kind of get
us there.

320
00:16:14,400 --> 00:16:18,320
I have been attending church
consistently from May until that

321
00:16:18,320 --> 00:16:22,320
August point and I just kept
hearing the word and hearing the

322
00:16:22,320 --> 00:16:25,720
word and hearing it.
And I just, I had, I was at that

323
00:16:25,720 --> 00:16:29,000
point in my life for like I had
already tried all the stuff that

324
00:16:29,000 --> 00:16:31,320
I said I wanted and I had
already tried all the stuff that

325
00:16:31,320 --> 00:16:33,960
I said was going to work for me.
That's how this whole story.

326
00:16:33,960 --> 00:16:36,160
So I had already said I'm going
to go live the life the world

327
00:16:36,160 --> 00:16:39,560
says I'm supposed to live.
And it was all crap.

328
00:16:39,920 --> 00:16:42,120
It was all chaos, It was all
madness.

329
00:16:42,120 --> 00:16:45,160
It was all violence, it was all
heartbreak, It was all anxiety,

330
00:16:45,160 --> 00:16:48,080
it was all depression.
It was, it was all, it was all

331
00:16:48,080 --> 00:16:50,280
chemical dependency.
It was all of these things, the

332
00:16:50,280 --> 00:16:52,000
opposite of what I was looking
for.

333
00:16:53,160 --> 00:16:54,960
It's fun in the moment until you
got to pay up.

334
00:16:56,280 --> 00:16:57,960
It's the worst credit card debt
ever.

335
00:16:58,120 --> 00:17:00,920
The interest was high.
It's the highest interest of all

336
00:17:00,920 --> 00:17:03,400
time because you're dealing with
life and death.

337
00:17:04,560 --> 00:17:08,400
So you just kept and I, I told
my head pastor like I, I just

338
00:17:08,400 --> 00:17:10,760
need to know what to do.
I, I, you said something about

339
00:17:10,760 --> 00:17:12,280
truth and love.
I, I hear you.

340
00:17:12,280 --> 00:17:15,040
I just need to know what to do.
He said, this is simple.

341
00:17:15,200 --> 00:17:18,200
Pick up this book, open it, read
it and do what it says.

342
00:17:20,079 --> 00:17:26,319
I'm like, OK, all right.
So I started with Proverbs and

343
00:17:26,319 --> 00:17:28,400
James and it was just like,
there you go.

344
00:17:28,400 --> 00:17:31,760
I'm like, there's instruction of
wisdom.

345
00:17:31,760 --> 00:17:35,360
I'm just going to start, I'm
just going to start doing this.

346
00:17:35,360 --> 00:17:36,760
I'm just going to start doing
it.

347
00:17:37,120 --> 00:17:39,200
And I just, I started seeing
some of the, some of the fruit

348
00:17:39,200 --> 00:17:41,800
from, from that.
And that's, yeah, man, that's,

349
00:17:41,800 --> 00:17:44,680
that's the main, I would say as
soon as I started hearing, I

350
00:17:44,680 --> 00:17:47,040
started hearing the word of God.
And then I started applying what

351
00:17:47,040 --> 00:17:50,000
I could to my life to get the to
get the easy wins right away,

352
00:17:50,000 --> 00:17:52,200
just to build up some durability
and some confidence.

353
00:17:52,840 --> 00:17:55,120
Yeah.
And that's leading up though.

354
00:17:55,120 --> 00:17:58,480
That's that that what you just
described there of get this

355
00:17:58,480 --> 00:18:02,800
book, read this book, apply.
This book was still between May

356
00:18:02,800 --> 00:18:04,280
and August.
Is that right?

357
00:18:04,400 --> 00:18:05,200
Yeah.
Yeah.

358
00:18:05,400 --> 00:18:08,760
OK.
So a lot of folks are going to

359
00:18:08,760 --> 00:18:10,920
be wondering because I certainly
am as well.

360
00:18:12,040 --> 00:18:17,200
You grow up with this background
that includes Catholic Church,

361
00:18:17,320 --> 00:18:20,280
Baptist Church.
You then decide, hey, I'm going

362
00:18:20,280 --> 00:18:24,960
to be I'm going to be the the
hero as a villain in my own

363
00:18:24,960 --> 00:18:26,800
story.
I'm going to write this thing

364
00:18:26,800 --> 00:18:33,840
different, but then eventually
you, it sounds like, and maybe

365
00:18:33,840 --> 00:18:37,440
you got to check me on this, but
eventually it sounds like you go

366
00:18:37,440 --> 00:18:44,240
back into church.
So what brings you back into

367
00:18:44,240 --> 00:18:48,160
church?
I think I always knew God was

368
00:18:48,160 --> 00:18:49,880
real.
I think I always knew he was

369
00:18:49,880 --> 00:18:53,000
there.
I think we get like we as in

370
00:18:53,000 --> 00:18:55,000
people, we get caught up.
Oh, you're Catholic or you're

371
00:18:55,000 --> 00:18:56,400
Baptist?
Doesn't mean you're not saved.

372
00:18:57,120 --> 00:18:58,800
That doesn't mean those people
don't have Jesus.

373
00:18:58,800 --> 00:19:01,360
You may not agree with all the
doctrine, which I don't that's I

374
00:19:01,360 --> 00:19:04,200
don't.
I go to a non denominational

375
00:19:04,200 --> 00:19:05,800
word based church.
I'm not attacking anybody.

376
00:19:05,840 --> 00:19:08,440
If you, if you follow Jesus in
my heart, you're not my enemy.

377
00:19:09,280 --> 00:19:11,680
It's it, it's just the way it's
it really is that black and

378
00:19:11,680 --> 00:19:14,760
white of a thing.
No matter how you feel about me

379
00:19:14,760 --> 00:19:17,160
or I may feel about you, I don't
view you in in such a way.

380
00:19:17,920 --> 00:19:21,080
So I think the foundation was
always there.

381
00:19:21,680 --> 00:19:24,160
The foundation was there.
It just wasn't getting lived

382
00:19:24,160 --> 00:19:27,640
out, you know, not to the degree
that it should have been to make

383
00:19:27,640 --> 00:19:29,400
it stick.
And I need a God to speak to me

384
00:19:29,400 --> 00:19:33,440
in a way that I would understand
and it that would literally just

385
00:19:33,440 --> 00:19:35,320
make it make it real and make it
stick.

386
00:19:35,320 --> 00:19:37,280
And I had to go through some
real life things.

387
00:19:37,280 --> 00:19:41,240
I saw real life based off the
life I said I wanted to see.

388
00:19:41,240 --> 00:19:44,720
He let me see it.
It was like, I'm going to open

389
00:19:44,720 --> 00:19:45,600
up.
Do you want to open up that

390
00:19:45,600 --> 00:19:46,840
door?
Go ahead.

391
00:19:48,000 --> 00:19:49,520
And none of it caught him by
surprise.

392
00:19:50,520 --> 00:19:52,120
And he led me back when the time
was right.

393
00:19:52,680 --> 00:20:01,360
OK, so you're in church.
We're going to call this post

394
00:20:01,360 --> 00:20:11,760
Your Grandmother passing.
And when is the sin and

395
00:20:11,760 --> 00:20:17,680
everything associated with it
piling up so heavy that you want

396
00:20:17,680 --> 00:20:21,360
to end things?
I'm a little fuzzy on the year

397
00:20:21,360 --> 00:20:23,760
of that.
It was definitely probably after

398
00:20:23,760 --> 00:20:25,360
that August date.
It was definitely after that

399
00:20:25,360 --> 00:20:30,440
August date.
Man, that's a oh man, I OK.

400
00:20:30,440 --> 00:20:33,640
So but but that's OK because
it's it's way less about the

401
00:20:33,640 --> 00:20:36,360
specifics of that.
But what you're really saying

402
00:20:36,360 --> 00:20:39,280
ultimately is, and this is kind
of why I want to explore this,

403
00:20:40,440 --> 00:20:46,720
that you're now saved.
Like this is no longer just, I

404
00:20:46,720 --> 00:20:50,720
intellectually understand God
and know about God because of my

405
00:20:50,720 --> 00:20:52,320
upbringing and those types of
things.

406
00:20:52,640 --> 00:20:58,800
This is I have now professed the
need for a savior and the IT

407
00:20:58,800 --> 00:21:01,480
sounds like again, you got to
check me on this, but it sounds

408
00:21:01,480 --> 00:21:05,400
like some of your behaviors
continued.

409
00:21:05,520 --> 00:21:09,520
Yes, despite the fact, of
course, that now the impacts for

410
00:21:09,520 --> 00:21:12,080
you are different.
You're seeing them.

411
00:21:12,080 --> 00:21:14,720
There's not there's not the
sweetness in them that they're

412
00:21:14,720 --> 00:21:16,280
at least would have been
temporarily.

413
00:21:16,280 --> 00:21:22,240
We'll say so because all of that
then builds to man, I got a lot

414
00:21:22,240 --> 00:21:25,000
of shame associated with this.
You know, I got a lot of

415
00:21:25,000 --> 00:21:26,440
heaviness with this.
So what?

416
00:21:26,440 --> 00:21:28,960
What was that whole experience
like for you?

417
00:21:29,480 --> 00:21:33,440
It was, it was terrible because
I wasn't like, why am I still

418
00:21:33,440 --> 00:21:34,440
doing this?
I don't even like it.

419
00:21:34,440 --> 00:21:37,960
I don't even enjoy it.
I mean, like, why is this still

420
00:21:37,960 --> 00:21:41,360
happening?
And it, it really speaks to the

421
00:21:41,360 --> 00:21:44,000
idea that you have to get to the
root cause of your problems.

422
00:21:45,040 --> 00:21:48,080
Because this was this was like
years, like the years that I was

423
00:21:48,080 --> 00:21:49,160
still dealing with some of this
stuff.

424
00:21:49,160 --> 00:21:53,120
Some stuff fell off right away,
but some stuff really, and some

425
00:21:53,120 --> 00:21:54,880
people are going to argue what
were you really saved?

426
00:21:54,880 --> 00:21:58,240
I can honestly tell you that
awareness, yes, absolutely

427
00:21:58,240 --> 00:22:00,760
because it it felt totally
different.

428
00:22:01,920 --> 00:22:04,080
It felt totally different.
I was also in those people like

429
00:22:04,080 --> 00:22:06,360
I was able to quote Bible verses
I had never read.

430
00:22:06,480 --> 00:22:09,520
So they're not going to tell me
like I know the Holy Spirit was

431
00:22:09,520 --> 00:22:12,200
in me at that point.
There was a lack of obedience.

432
00:22:12,200 --> 00:22:16,200
There was a lot of, I never
really got to the root of the

433
00:22:16,200 --> 00:22:18,960
rejection until much later,
much, much later.

434
00:22:19,440 --> 00:22:24,240
And once I realized that, it was
like they all completely taken

435
00:22:24,240 --> 00:22:26,680
off.
You know, it was like, man, now

436
00:22:26,680 --> 00:22:31,120
that I see that and I realized I
don't have to do anything like I

437
00:22:31,120 --> 00:22:32,920
used to do, and I can finally
just be me.

438
00:22:33,560 --> 00:22:35,640
When I realized I could just be
me, that's when everything

439
00:22:35,640 --> 00:22:37,080
changed.
And by me being me, I mean the

440
00:22:37,080 --> 00:22:39,280
person God created me to be, to
do what he called me to do.

441
00:22:39,280 --> 00:22:42,040
Because everything I said the
beginning of this show, none of

442
00:22:42,040 --> 00:22:43,440
that started happening until
afterwards.

443
00:22:43,880 --> 00:22:46,640
It sounds like you're kind of
getting to the end of yourself

444
00:22:47,160 --> 00:22:51,600
and all of the impacts of sin.
Again, just trying to use some

445
00:22:51,600 --> 00:22:59,680
of your language here and you
end up having a phone call,

446
00:23:00,480 --> 00:23:02,560
right?
Like let's let's go into that

447
00:23:02,560 --> 00:23:07,160
more because you described how
like you are seriously

448
00:23:07,160 --> 00:23:11,640
contemplating as you use the
term unaliving yourself.

449
00:23:12,080 --> 00:23:16,000
OK.
And then you get some, it sounds

450
00:23:16,000 --> 00:23:18,720
like some straight truth spoken
to you.

451
00:23:18,840 --> 00:23:20,760
Break that whole thing down for
us.

452
00:23:21,280 --> 00:23:25,880
Yeah, he was really talking to
me about like, like you, if

453
00:23:25,880 --> 00:23:28,080
you're, you're reading the word,
you're getting this awareness,

454
00:23:28,080 --> 00:23:31,120
but you're not applying it in
doing what it says.

455
00:23:31,280 --> 00:23:33,160
And he?
But even even before that, I'm

456
00:23:33,160 --> 00:23:35,800
interrupting you just because
like take us back to like, this

457
00:23:35,800 --> 00:23:37,960
is what I'm feeling.
This is what I'm thinking, this

458
00:23:37,960 --> 00:23:40,320
is what I'm about to do.
And then it sounds like the

459
00:23:40,320 --> 00:23:43,280
phone.
Rings it felt like when you

460
00:23:43,280 --> 00:23:48,240
become aware of saying it felt
like and then you go back to it

461
00:23:48,920 --> 00:23:51,480
like it felt like there was a
Mack truck on my chest.

462
00:23:52,400 --> 00:23:55,240
Like it.
The weight of that felt like and

463
00:23:55,240 --> 00:23:58,480
I I felt there were there was.
It was not just a heaviness.

464
00:23:58,480 --> 00:24:02,360
It felt like something I could
not move is the best way I I

465
00:24:02,360 --> 00:24:05,080
could.
I could describe that and that

466
00:24:05,080 --> 00:24:07,400
you just start feeling like why
am I here?

467
00:24:07,560 --> 00:24:09,320
Why am I bothering?
Why am I trying?

468
00:24:09,320 --> 00:24:10,480
I'm always going to be a screw
up.

469
00:24:10,480 --> 00:24:12,960
I'm always going to be messing
something up.

470
00:24:13,400 --> 00:24:16,680
You know what I mean?
Like, why am I even still doing,

471
00:24:16,880 --> 00:24:20,880
even trying this out?
Like I'm so bad at being good.

472
00:24:20,880 --> 00:24:25,520
Like why am I even bothering,
you know, like it's and it was

473
00:24:25,520 --> 00:24:28,720
just that it, I felt the weight
of of those choices.

474
00:24:28,720 --> 00:24:31,880
I'm not making any excuses and
I'm just, I refuse, you know,

475
00:24:32,280 --> 00:24:37,080
and he called me and he was just
telling me he's like, and he

476
00:24:37,080 --> 00:24:39,920
started breaking down like why
you're having the issues you are

477
00:24:39,920 --> 00:24:45,880
having, like calling the sin out
by by exact name, like not even

478
00:24:45,880 --> 00:24:48,880
not pulling a single punch, you
know?

479
00:24:48,960 --> 00:24:52,480
And it just, I realized by
calling the problem out by name,

480
00:24:52,480 --> 00:24:54,320
he just started it cut right to
it.

481
00:24:54,320 --> 00:24:55,760
It just started cutting right to
it.

482
00:24:56,880 --> 00:25:00,720
And he just learning and he was
really walking me through the

483
00:25:00,720 --> 00:25:05,960
concept of temptation versus
sin, but putting boundaries up

484
00:25:06,680 --> 00:25:10,400
to not even get anywhere near
that temptation line.

485
00:25:11,400 --> 00:25:14,040
So it doesn't even get to the
sin line because even if the

486
00:25:14,040 --> 00:25:16,240
temptation is there, I'm staying
so far away from it.

487
00:25:16,240 --> 00:25:18,920
I still in a, in a safe enough
distance to, to move away.

488
00:25:19,720 --> 00:25:22,880
So that's, that's like the a lot
of what that call is about.

489
00:25:22,880 --> 00:25:26,360
But I mean, it was, it was
heavily rooted in, in addiction.

490
00:25:26,440 --> 00:25:30,280
I mean heavily rooted in lust.
It was so it was heavy.

491
00:25:30,600 --> 00:25:32,840
It was heavy.
And, you know, you, you, you

492
00:25:32,840 --> 00:25:34,880
think of the scripture now about
the dog returning back to his

493
00:25:34,880 --> 00:25:37,960
own vomit, you know, or like,
the person who cleans out his

494
00:25:37,960 --> 00:25:42,640
house, the demons came back and
it's empty, you know, So now

495
00:25:42,640 --> 00:25:44,440
you're in a worse state than you
were before, you know.

496
00:25:44,480 --> 00:25:47,520
So this is some of the stuff
that was in my head, you know,

497
00:25:47,560 --> 00:25:50,440
at the at the time.
Yeah.

498
00:25:50,520 --> 00:25:56,240
Wow.
So what happens right after that

499
00:25:57,040 --> 00:25:59,960
terms of like the impact, the
change for you?

500
00:26:00,560 --> 00:26:03,200
I wish I could tell you like
everything happened so quick.

501
00:26:03,440 --> 00:26:05,240
I wish I could tell you that,
man, it didn't.

502
00:26:05,440 --> 00:26:11,240
It did not I, I fully got
focused and serious.

503
00:26:11,720 --> 00:26:14,240
Like once it was like, it was
like literally the layers, the

504
00:26:14,240 --> 00:26:16,040
layers got started peeling back
off.

505
00:26:16,040 --> 00:26:18,600
Like I put down one thing, there
was something else.

506
00:26:18,600 --> 00:26:20,400
I put down one thing, there was
something else, you put down

507
00:26:20,400 --> 00:26:22,120
another thing.
Why am I so angry now?

508
00:26:23,200 --> 00:26:24,800
You put down a, you put down
another thing.

509
00:26:24,800 --> 00:26:27,000
It's like, why is this still
still not working?

510
00:26:27,000 --> 00:26:30,080
Like why am I still seeking?
Didn't know why I was still

511
00:26:30,080 --> 00:26:33,200
seeking this, this attention.
I don't know if you're familiar

512
00:26:33,200 --> 00:26:35,080
with the Azusa conference.
I believe it started in

513
00:26:35,080 --> 00:26:37,440
California, but it goes around
like the United States.

514
00:26:38,440 --> 00:26:40,960
They came to Cleveland 2016 and
2017.

515
00:26:41,400 --> 00:26:46,400
They did an altar call and they
said God is calling you right

516
00:26:46,400 --> 00:26:49,320
now.
And they said come down to the

517
00:26:49,320 --> 00:26:52,920
floor, which if you've, you just
don't do that.

518
00:26:52,920 --> 00:26:55,080
Like your tickets are where your
tickets are.

519
00:26:55,080 --> 00:26:58,520
You know, they said no way.
They did a full on altar call in

520
00:26:58,520 --> 00:27:02,840
that arena and it was crazy.
And that's when I was like, you

521
00:27:02,840 --> 00:27:04,400
know what, I'm done with all
this crap.

522
00:27:04,400 --> 00:27:07,880
I just don't want it.
I just don't want it.

523
00:27:08,680 --> 00:27:11,680
Lord, I'm finally seeing freedom
in being who you're calling me

524
00:27:11,680 --> 00:27:13,800
to be.
I don't have to look to man for

525
00:27:13,800 --> 00:27:18,400
approval or or for acceptance.
And a lot of this really started

526
00:27:18,400 --> 00:27:22,240
in 2015, 2016, you know, just
from some different men's groups

527
00:27:22,240 --> 00:27:24,360
I started attending just some
different books.

528
00:27:24,360 --> 00:27:26,920
I started reading different
sessions, just different levels

529
00:27:26,920 --> 00:27:29,680
of transparency, things that I
was sins that I was confessing

530
00:27:29,680 --> 00:27:35,200
people I was talking to.
But 2017, I put the pedal to the

531
00:27:35,200 --> 00:27:36,760
floor and I said this is, this
is it.

532
00:27:36,840 --> 00:27:42,240
I we, we need to really get
serious about this and put away

533
00:27:42,600 --> 00:27:44,280
some of these destructive
behaviors.

534
00:27:45,760 --> 00:27:49,560
Yeah, it also sounds like you
put your knees on the floor in

535
00:27:49,560 --> 00:27:51,720
that arena.
Man, it was crazy in there.

536
00:27:51,960 --> 00:27:55,400
It was crazy in there.
To see all those people empty

537
00:27:55,400 --> 00:27:58,200
out the upper deck to come down
the floor for an altar call.

538
00:27:58,200 --> 00:28:00,080
I'd never, I've never actually
seen anything like that in

539
00:28:00,080 --> 00:28:01,840
person.
I mean, I've seen I've seen

540
00:28:01,840 --> 00:28:06,400
people I've seen alter calls at,
at like concerts or, or hip hop

541
00:28:06,400 --> 00:28:08,040
and rap shows.
I've seen you.

542
00:28:08,040 --> 00:28:09,720
I've seen them obviously at
churches.

543
00:28:10,240 --> 00:28:11,920
I'm not.
That was the only time I think

544
00:28:11,920 --> 00:28:13,760
I've seen one in person at an
arena.

545
00:28:13,760 --> 00:28:17,520
I was like, man, this is This is
why they do it.

546
00:28:17,640 --> 00:28:20,720
This is it.
Yeah, because there really is

547
00:28:20,720 --> 00:28:25,240
transformation that can happen.
Yeah, well, you use the word

548
00:28:25,240 --> 00:28:27,480
freedom.
You talked about beginning to

549
00:28:27,480 --> 00:28:31,720
experience freedom when you were
being the man that you

550
00:28:31,920 --> 00:28:35,520
identified as as God creating
you to be.

551
00:28:36,480 --> 00:28:40,560
Tell us more about all that.
It's it's how God has kept me

552
00:28:40,560 --> 00:28:43,120
humble.
It's been the thing in in my

553
00:28:43,120 --> 00:28:46,280
side that he has not pulled out
is how there is just a level of

554
00:28:46,320 --> 00:28:48,720
unawareness sometimes the stuff
that he's asked me to do that

555
00:28:48,720 --> 00:28:50,760
I'm just doing.
I would go to the gym and I

556
00:28:50,760 --> 00:28:54,240
would just talk to people about
Jesus because my voice was so

557
00:28:54,240 --> 00:28:57,200
destructive and my actions were
so destructive.

558
00:28:57,640 --> 00:28:59,880
And I'm like, why would I want
anybody to be like me?

559
00:29:00,240 --> 00:29:03,080
Why would I want anybody or why
would I want anybody to?

560
00:29:03,200 --> 00:29:05,000
And some of it was just
self-destructive thought.

561
00:29:05,000 --> 00:29:08,320
Like it wasn't always a healthy
thought or like why would I want

562
00:29:08,320 --> 00:29:09,920
anybody to go through the stuff
that I went through?

563
00:29:10,440 --> 00:29:13,480
So I would just anybody who
would even make eye contact with

564
00:29:13,480 --> 00:29:16,560
me, I would just find a way to
invite him to church, invite him

565
00:29:16,560 --> 00:29:19,720
to a church function, get ready
to pray over him, to lead him

566
00:29:19,720 --> 00:29:23,200
the Lord, invite him to, you
know, whatever it was something

567
00:29:23,200 --> 00:29:24,960
can't invite him to a small
group, whatever.

568
00:29:25,120 --> 00:29:27,720
I go to chart one day and my
head passes like, yeah, you're

569
00:29:27,760 --> 00:29:29,320
you know that.
Do you know those guys over

570
00:29:29,320 --> 00:29:31,720
there?
I'm like, yeah, he's like that

571
00:29:31,720 --> 00:29:35,720
whole section is filled with
guys from the gym you go to.

572
00:29:35,720 --> 00:29:37,840
And I was like, oh, they
actually showed up.

573
00:29:37,880 --> 00:29:40,320
It's crazy.
I'm not thinking anything of it.

574
00:29:40,320 --> 00:29:43,040
I'm I'm really not like not to
the degree that he was.

575
00:29:44,400 --> 00:29:46,720
And he said to me, he said,
yeah, you're really doing the

576
00:29:46,720 --> 00:29:51,880
work of the the evangelist.
And I said, Yep, sure are happy

577
00:29:51,880 --> 00:29:54,560
to do it.
When he walked away, I pulled

578
00:29:54,560 --> 00:29:56,440
out my phone on Google.
When was an evangelist.

579
00:29:56,440 --> 00:30:00,400
I didn't, I didn't, I didn't, I
didn't look at the Bible like I

580
00:30:00,400 --> 00:30:01,800
didn't do that.
Like, what the heck is an

581
00:30:01,800 --> 00:30:05,880
evangelist?
And I'm like, huh, this kind of

582
00:30:05,880 --> 00:30:09,560
fits.
And I said.

583
00:30:09,760 --> 00:30:13,240
That's hilarious.
I'm, I've, I've told this like

584
00:30:13,240 --> 00:30:15,360
I'm like, huh, this is actually
true.

585
00:30:16,840 --> 00:30:19,360
So I just started using it to
just really kind of just like

586
00:30:19,360 --> 00:30:22,480
tell, like there's another way
to live, like there is a total

587
00:30:22,480 --> 00:30:25,880
another way to, to live your
life that there is that

588
00:30:25,880 --> 00:30:29,560
emptiness that pit you feel.
There is something in Christ for

589
00:30:29,560 --> 00:30:32,400
you and it's everything that you
are seeking.

590
00:30:32,400 --> 00:30:34,600
And it's mostly you probably
don't even know.

591
00:30:35,320 --> 00:30:38,160
I also got a phone call from my
head pastor when I was at work

592
00:30:38,160 --> 00:30:42,440
and he said, you know, I've been
praying for five years for a

593
00:30:42,440 --> 00:30:45,800
director of community outreach
and he's like, I really think

594
00:30:45,800 --> 00:30:49,360
it's supposed to be you.
And I had to repent for this.

595
00:30:49,720 --> 00:30:51,360
I hate even telling this part of
the story.

596
00:30:51,360 --> 00:30:54,840
But I said, you've been praying
for five years and I'm what you

597
00:30:54,840 --> 00:30:56,240
came up with.
Are you sure?

598
00:31:01,600 --> 00:31:04,400
Thank God if this man is a tough
guy because he, I don't know how

599
00:31:04,400 --> 00:31:05,800
he put on me for as long as he
did.

600
00:31:06,240 --> 00:31:10,680
And he said, yes, he said, yes,
it's supposed to be he's like

601
00:31:10,680 --> 00:31:13,600
everything you do as far as
community and everything you're,

602
00:31:13,600 --> 00:31:16,760
you're already like everything
that I've been praying for.

603
00:31:16,760 --> 00:31:18,560
You are fitting this, this, this
mold.

604
00:31:19,160 --> 00:31:21,520
And I'm like, all right, no
problem.

605
00:31:22,520 --> 00:31:26,280
And so it's, that's when it got
it really got started was, was

606
00:31:27,360 --> 00:31:31,880
seeing other people and seeing
that they could come to Christ

607
00:31:31,920 --> 00:31:35,400
without having some of the
pitfalls that I had, but

608
00:31:35,400 --> 00:31:40,600
understanding like where they
are because like I live that let

609
00:31:40,600 --> 00:31:42,200
me help you navigate through
this.

610
00:31:42,200 --> 00:31:44,160
So you don't have to do it the
way that I did it.

611
00:31:44,400 --> 00:31:46,920
So literally letting my
testimony be light to them.

612
00:31:47,640 --> 00:31:50,080
So that's, that's some of that
stuff that would that that help

613
00:31:50,080 --> 00:31:53,080
with that freedom.
Like when you see somebody's

614
00:31:53,080 --> 00:31:57,240
eyes just change colors because
they're now following the Lord

615
00:31:58,240 --> 00:32:01,760
or they've gotten that, that aha
moment in Christ, or they've

616
00:32:01,760 --> 00:32:03,960
gotten that break.
They're waiting for minutes.

617
00:32:04,280 --> 00:32:06,920
That's the best drug that you
could ever, ever be on.

618
00:32:06,920 --> 00:32:08,760
That's the best high you could
ever have.

619
00:32:09,240 --> 00:32:12,640
It's it's not cliche.
It's, it's a real experience.

620
00:32:12,640 --> 00:32:19,760
When you see that, praise God.
Well, Eric, let's talk a little

621
00:32:19,760 --> 00:32:29,200
bit about the fact that you got
a phone call when you're

622
00:32:29,200 --> 00:32:38,120
considering on aliving yourself
and you got clarity through

623
00:32:38,400 --> 00:32:43,000
three blasts at the train horn
that sounded like bombs going

624
00:32:43,000 --> 00:32:47,040
off in your apartment.
Like, was all of that type of

625
00:32:47,040 --> 00:32:54,840
stuff coincidence or God?
It's 100% God and I, I'm not

626
00:32:54,840 --> 00:32:57,320
the, I don't believe in the
coincidence, you know, I just

627
00:32:57,320 --> 00:33:02,480
don't like, I, I believe you
reap what you sow I, I believe

628
00:33:02,480 --> 00:33:04,680
in divine appointments.
It's, it's hands down.

629
00:33:05,120 --> 00:33:07,320
Oh God.
If God didn't want me here, I

630
00:33:07,320 --> 00:33:10,480
would not be here.
If it would have been my time,

631
00:33:10,480 --> 00:33:14,440
it would have been my time, the
road that I was on.

632
00:33:15,000 --> 00:33:19,200
I'm not sure if I've lived past
my late 20s, mid 30s.

633
00:33:19,360 --> 00:33:22,800
I'm not sure I'm just not and I,
I don't say that.

634
00:33:23,640 --> 00:33:26,320
I say that more like as I'm now
thinking backwards, like

635
00:33:26,320 --> 00:33:28,360
hindsight, like right now talk
to you like, I don't know,

636
00:33:29,560 --> 00:33:31,840
there's no way I'd be in good
health right now even if I did

637
00:33:31,840 --> 00:33:36,880
make it to be 42, you know,
434445, possibly 51 day.

638
00:33:36,880 --> 00:33:42,160
You know, it's, it's, it's hands
down, God's hand is covering his

639
00:33:42,160 --> 00:33:44,480
protection, all of it, without a
doubt.

640
00:33:45,680 --> 00:33:50,920
Yeah, right on, dude.
How has your life changed as a

641
00:33:50,920 --> 00:33:54,560
result of all of this?
I don't even know where to start

642
00:33:54,560 --> 00:33:58,640
to answer that question, but
it's like I, I've, I've seen

643
00:33:58,640 --> 00:34:01,560
some crazy trials even like in
the past few years and I'm like,

644
00:34:01,560 --> 00:34:04,200
no, God, I see you in this.
We don't have to.

645
00:34:04,480 --> 00:34:08,120
I see how I deal with situations
completely differently.

646
00:34:08,120 --> 00:34:10,080
I see how I deal with problems
differently.

647
00:34:10,560 --> 00:34:14,840
I see how I pray differently,
how I fast differently, the

648
00:34:14,840 --> 00:34:18,639
things that I run to when I'm
just like, oh man, today has

649
00:34:18,639 --> 00:34:20,440
just been rough.
You know, we don't, we don't

650
00:34:20,440 --> 00:34:24,639
deal with things the same way.
I see it through the nonprofit,

651
00:34:24,639 --> 00:34:27,520
through the podcast, through
through concert series.

652
00:34:27,520 --> 00:34:29,880
I see it through all.
I see his hand in all of it.

653
00:34:30,440 --> 00:34:33,360
It's in so many, but I have so
many testimonies just like God

654
00:34:33,360 --> 00:34:36,840
showing up and showing out in
situations that just look like

655
00:34:36,840 --> 00:34:39,719
dead on the water.
I'm grateful that I can finally

656
00:34:39,719 --> 00:34:44,199
just be Eric and I don't have to
put on a show to be somebody

657
00:34:44,199 --> 00:34:46,719
else.
And he gave me all of these, all

658
00:34:46,719 --> 00:34:51,600
of these things I'm doing right
now at the right season because

659
00:34:51,760 --> 00:34:54,320
20 some year old me would not be
able to sit here and talk to you

660
00:34:55,920 --> 00:35:01,440
with without my pride being 100%
present, without me saying look

661
00:35:01,440 --> 00:35:05,760
at what Eric did when I know
Eric was the first part of that

662
00:35:05,760 --> 00:35:07,720
story.
Eric made the choice to walk

663
00:35:07,720 --> 00:35:10,360
away.
God was like, I'm going to just

664
00:35:10,360 --> 00:35:12,480
protect you as much.
You know I'm going to protect

665
00:35:12,480 --> 00:35:15,600
you in this, in this season
where you are exploring, for

666
00:35:15,600 --> 00:35:19,040
lack of a better word right now.
Well, I want to explore one

667
00:35:19,040 --> 00:35:21,440
thing, man, before we wrap up
here.

668
00:35:23,560 --> 00:35:31,640
You talked about being saved
August of 2010, but that there

669
00:35:31,640 --> 00:35:37,160
was clear change, kind of
immediate and then an ongoing

670
00:35:37,160 --> 00:35:41,600
process of what you kind of
described as these layers

671
00:35:42,440 --> 00:35:44,880
putting something down and then
there's something else, putting

672
00:35:44,880 --> 00:35:46,880
something down and then there's
something else.

673
00:35:47,560 --> 00:35:50,680
And I think that there's a lot
of folks that can relate to

674
00:35:50,680 --> 00:35:53,640
that.
But give us a sense for like

675
00:35:54,040 --> 00:35:59,080
over roughly what period of time
was all of that for you to where

676
00:35:59,080 --> 00:36:02,160
you go from for sure being
saved.

677
00:36:02,240 --> 00:36:04,960
Holy Spirit enters you, no
doubt, like you said, very

678
00:36:04,960 --> 00:36:11,600
convinced, very convincingly to
that altar call of where you're

679
00:36:11,600 --> 00:36:15,920
like, we're putting all of this
down, like where there's another

680
00:36:15,920 --> 00:36:19,880
change, if you will, because I
think a lot of people can relate

681
00:36:19,920 --> 00:36:23,800
to that type of progression.
Tell us about what that was like

682
00:36:23,800 --> 00:36:27,080
in terms of timelines and stuff.
Man, I don't even, I mean that

683
00:36:27,080 --> 00:36:30,800
would be, I mean you're talking
like 5-6 years of a timeline,

684
00:36:30,880 --> 00:36:34,520
you know what I mean?
And that's assuming that

685
00:36:34,520 --> 00:36:38,120
conference in 2017 and not 2016.
I get these days so confused,

686
00:36:38,120 --> 00:36:42,760
but it's, I mean, you're talking
about a solid five years of, of

687
00:36:42,760 --> 00:36:46,560
just real transformation.
And the hard part about that is,

688
00:36:47,560 --> 00:36:50,760
you know, you're changing, but
other people still see all of

689
00:36:50,760 --> 00:36:54,560
all of this.
You know, I remember I, I'd,

690
00:36:54,560 --> 00:36:57,440
I've said this like I went to
church and right when it was

691
00:36:57,440 --> 00:37:00,000
over, I would go drink or right
when it was over, I would go get

692
00:37:00,000 --> 00:37:01,960
high.
And I don't think, I don't think

693
00:37:01,960 --> 00:37:03,960
there's enough people out there
who are willing to actually say

694
00:37:03,960 --> 00:37:05,440
the truth.
Like, yeah, I don't really want

695
00:37:05,440 --> 00:37:06,960
to come to your house and watch
the Browns game.

696
00:37:07,080 --> 00:37:10,640
No, I'm going to go home and
watch it because my refrigerator

697
00:37:10,640 --> 00:37:12,560
of what I have in it is there.
You know what I mean?

698
00:37:14,280 --> 00:37:18,520
So I would say that was like 5
or 6 years of just heavy, heavy

699
00:37:18,600 --> 00:37:21,840
mistake after mistake, you know,
or just, and it was really not,

700
00:37:21,880 --> 00:37:24,480
it was just bad choice, just bad
choice, a bad choice.

701
00:37:24,480 --> 00:37:26,440
And probably could have been
more transparent, probably could

702
00:37:26,440 --> 00:37:28,200
have been more vulnerable,
probably could have opened up to

703
00:37:28,200 --> 00:37:32,640
a few more men.
So yeah, I would say that's

704
00:37:32,640 --> 00:37:35,360
probably about I'd I'd give it
that time frame.

705
00:37:36,080 --> 00:37:39,800
Yeah, but it gots working on you
in the that entire process.

706
00:37:39,800 --> 00:37:41,600
So it wasn't trying to imply
that it wasn't, no.

707
00:37:41,600 --> 00:37:43,800
I'm with you.
It was the, IT was definitely, I

708
00:37:43,800 --> 00:37:46,680
mean, you can see his hand and I
know it because like the

709
00:37:46,680 --> 00:37:50,080
difference of what it was like
before versus what it was like

710
00:37:50,080 --> 00:37:51,600
after, it didn't, it wasn't the
same.

711
00:37:52,240 --> 00:37:54,440
I was never happy doing the
things I was doing.

712
00:37:54,800 --> 00:37:57,760
It felt like something I
couldn't stop doing even though

713
00:37:57,760 --> 00:38:00,560
I wanted to stop doing it, you
know, I knew it was wrong.

714
00:38:00,600 --> 00:38:03,880
I did not want to keep.
Doing it, and I think a lot of

715
00:38:03,880 --> 00:38:08,120
people can relate to that.
Well, you described, Eric, how

716
00:38:08,120 --> 00:38:13,320
God's giving you certain things
all in the right seasons.

717
00:38:13,880 --> 00:38:18,880
And much of that right is
concert series and beyond, like

718
00:38:18,880 --> 00:38:22,000
we talked about at the
beginning, Rooted in Christ, the

719
00:38:22,000 --> 00:38:24,240
podcast, the ministry of
Redwood.

720
00:38:24,240 --> 00:38:27,440
Like, tell us about all of that
and all the work you're doing

721
00:38:27,440 --> 00:38:29,560
now.
Yeah, man, it was.

722
00:38:30,520 --> 00:38:34,360
I'll tell you, the Redwood trees
in California, they, they grow

723
00:38:34,360 --> 00:38:36,240
to be about four hundred 450
feet tall.

724
00:38:36,880 --> 00:38:41,040
And the roots of these trees are
only 6 feet deep, but they go on

725
00:38:41,040 --> 00:38:44,560
for for miles.
The tree roots are interlocked

726
00:38:44,560 --> 00:38:48,600
and intertwined.
So these trees literally uplift,

727
00:38:48,600 --> 00:38:53,200
support and hold one another up.
These trees also battle storms

728
00:38:53,200 --> 00:38:55,320
together.
So a storm comes in, it's almost

729
00:38:55,320 --> 00:38:56,760
like a funnel.
They push it right out.

730
00:38:58,040 --> 00:39:00,280
And since these trees are so
massive, it's they're their own

731
00:39:00,280 --> 00:39:02,560
ecosystem.
They take care of birds and

732
00:39:02,560 --> 00:39:04,720
animals live on it.
They'd like water and nourished

733
00:39:04,720 --> 00:39:07,200
air around it.
So if you see a Redwood tree

734
00:39:07,200 --> 00:39:09,000
down, that means it got isolated
somehow.

735
00:39:09,480 --> 00:39:11,800
And when the Holy Spirit gave me
that, I said, this is the way

736
00:39:11,800 --> 00:39:15,680
Christianity is supposed to be,
not this church versus that

737
00:39:15,680 --> 00:39:17,120
church.
Not you speak in tongues and I

738
00:39:17,120 --> 00:39:18,920
don't not you have tattoos and I
don't.

739
00:39:19,120 --> 00:39:22,680
What do we do with Jesus?
What is the foundational thing

740
00:39:22,680 --> 00:39:25,280
of our walk?
So God put it on my heart.

741
00:39:25,280 --> 00:39:27,840
IN2020I launched A nonprofit
called Redwood Christian

742
00:39:27,840 --> 00:39:30,640
Ministries.
And we stand on salvation,

743
00:39:30,800 --> 00:39:33,480
discipleship and and unity in
the body of Christ with church

744
00:39:33,480 --> 00:39:36,760
unity, us actually being the
church, which is why my banner

745
00:39:36,760 --> 00:39:42,200
says be the church.
So it's, it's, it's so much of

746
00:39:42,200 --> 00:39:46,320
just taking your faith and
living it out, but not doing it

747
00:39:46,320 --> 00:39:50,200
alone and doing it with the
right people around you.

748
00:39:51,160 --> 00:39:52,920
Not that there's people in your
Church of the wrong.

749
00:39:52,920 --> 00:39:56,080
They just may not be the people
for you for where you're going

750
00:39:56,080 --> 00:40:01,240
right now.
So that didn't let into another

751
00:40:01,240 --> 00:40:03,640
whole story of disobedience
where like God told me to start

752
00:40:03,640 --> 00:40:09,560
a podcast, I told him no and 170
episodes as of yesterday.

753
00:40:09,560 --> 00:40:12,160
You can see how well me telling
God no went so.

754
00:40:14,800 --> 00:40:19,920
So that happened and that led
into a Christian hip hop and R&B

755
00:40:19,920 --> 00:40:23,120
concert series that we're now
running at the House of Blues in

756
00:40:23,120 --> 00:40:25,880
in Cleveland.
And even just this past year, we

757
00:40:25,880 --> 00:40:28,400
saw 4 to 50 people raise their
hands to give their life to

758
00:40:28,400 --> 00:40:30,040
Christ or rededicate their life
to Lord.

759
00:40:30,040 --> 00:40:32,840
So it's been, it's been a wild
ride, man.

760
00:40:33,360 --> 00:40:35,680
I couldn't predict.
I couldn't have predicted any of

761
00:40:35,680 --> 00:40:36,240
this.
I didn't.

762
00:40:36,320 --> 00:40:41,240
This is not what I asked for.
That's the condensed version of

763
00:40:41,240 --> 00:40:43,760
that with me being respectful.
Your time or your show?

764
00:40:44,800 --> 00:40:48,480
Yeah, I can relate to the
comment that you made about this

765
00:40:48,480 --> 00:40:51,280
isn't what I asked for.
And yet what I, what I think is

766
00:40:51,280 --> 00:40:52,760
so neat.
You know, lots of people are

767
00:40:52,760 --> 00:40:55,400
obviously watching this, but
there's gonna be some folks that

768
00:40:55,400 --> 00:40:58,480
are just listening, man.
And, and the smile that is on

769
00:40:58,480 --> 00:41:01,400
your face, dude, when you talk
about all this stuff, I love it.

770
00:41:01,400 --> 00:41:02,480
You know?
You're doing what you're

771
00:41:02,480 --> 00:41:04,040
supposed.
Yeah, you just said I love it.

772
00:41:04,040 --> 00:41:08,720
You know, it's it's evident that
it's what you're supposed to be

773
00:41:08,720 --> 00:41:10,720
doing.
So that is really cool.

774
00:41:11,280 --> 00:41:15,760
OK, last question for you, you
talked about taking your faith

775
00:41:16,440 --> 00:41:23,000
and living it out.
Give our listeners some advice

776
00:41:23,000 --> 00:41:25,480
from all of your experience with
that.

777
00:41:26,320 --> 00:41:30,320
What is a good way or ways for
them to do that?

778
00:41:30,680 --> 00:41:34,280
Because those are those are
great words, right?

779
00:41:34,680 --> 00:41:39,160
And I know they're not hollow
from you, but a lot of people

780
00:41:39,160 --> 00:41:42,120
could hear those and wonder, OK,
that's great.

781
00:41:42,120 --> 00:41:44,200
What statement?
Like I know what to do what

782
00:41:44,200 --> 00:41:46,240
Eric, would you said like, how
do I do that?

783
00:41:46,400 --> 00:41:50,440
So break that down for us.
If you don't really want to do

784
00:41:50,440 --> 00:41:52,880
it, don't take my advice right
now because what I'm going to

785
00:41:52,880 --> 00:41:54,520
tell you, God is going to answer
you.

786
00:41:55,000 --> 00:41:57,320
But the Great Commission falls
on all of us.

787
00:41:57,840 --> 00:42:01,440
That's not just for the quote UN
quote evangelist ever the Great

788
00:42:01,440 --> 00:42:03,360
Commission.
Those red letters apply to

789
00:42:03,520 --> 00:42:05,440
everybody who has given the
heart of the Lord.

790
00:42:07,000 --> 00:42:08,800
God did not Commission us to do
something.

791
00:42:08,800 --> 00:42:11,120
He is not going to be with us
while we're doing it.

792
00:42:11,640 --> 00:42:12,960
So it's not that you can't do
it.

793
00:42:14,120 --> 00:42:15,720
It's a question of do you really
want to?

794
00:42:17,000 --> 00:42:20,120
Because in the Bible says that
the harvest is plentiful and the

795
00:42:20,120 --> 00:42:23,760
workers are few.
That means one very, that means

796
00:42:23,760 --> 00:42:26,240
it means a few things, but one
thing for sure, that it means

797
00:42:26,440 --> 00:42:27,880
there is not a shortage of
people.

798
00:42:27,880 --> 00:42:30,280
There's a shortage of people who
want to share their message and

799
00:42:30,280 --> 00:42:31,800
share the gospel.
There's not a shortage of

800
00:42:31,800 --> 00:42:32,680
people.
We need to hear it.

801
00:42:32,680 --> 00:42:34,520
We have a shortage of people
willing to share it.

802
00:42:35,800 --> 00:42:41,000
So step one, pray Lord, who can
I share my faith with?

803
00:42:42,040 --> 00:42:44,240
Step 2, How?
Lord, show me how.

804
00:42:44,600 --> 00:42:49,240
Lord, give me the opportunity
and have your testimony like

805
00:42:49,320 --> 00:42:52,320
ready to go like, and I don't
mean like everything that we

806
00:42:52,320 --> 00:42:55,280
just shared, because even then I
gave you some bullet points and

807
00:42:55,280 --> 00:42:58,480
I'm even now like we could we
could have dove in heavy on 45

808
00:42:58,480 --> 00:42:59,960
minutes or either one of those
things.

809
00:42:59,960 --> 00:43:01,760
I talked about it specifically
for one topic.

810
00:43:02,640 --> 00:43:05,760
Have your two to four minute
salvation speech ready.

811
00:43:06,200 --> 00:43:09,560
You know, know your audience,
you know, you don't have to go

812
00:43:09,560 --> 00:43:11,560
on and give them every single
gory detail.

813
00:43:12,320 --> 00:43:15,160
But when Paul said I was all
things, but sometimes those gory

814
00:43:15,160 --> 00:43:18,160
details are necessary.
So when Paul said all things to

815
00:43:18,160 --> 00:43:20,360
all people, when I was a Jew, I
became a Jew and I was a

816
00:43:20,360 --> 00:43:22,760
Gentile, I became a Gentile.
So some might be one.

817
00:43:22,760 --> 00:43:24,880
I'm quoting on 1st Corinthians
9.

818
00:43:24,880 --> 00:43:27,680
I believe it's 19 through 23.
So go read that so you get the

819
00:43:27,680 --> 00:43:30,000
full Scripture, not just the cut
of what I just gave you.

820
00:43:31,640 --> 00:43:35,760
But when you put that in
context, the man Paul is

821
00:43:35,760 --> 00:43:38,160
delivering the message of
salvation and the only thing he

822
00:43:38,160 --> 00:43:42,360
tweaked is the method.
He never compromised, he just

823
00:43:42,360 --> 00:43:45,680
tweaked the method so he was
aware of who he was talking to.

824
00:43:45,960 --> 00:43:48,200
So Holy Spirit, interrupt my
day.

825
00:43:48,480 --> 00:43:50,960
Pray that if you were the Holy
Spirit, interrupt my day for

826
00:43:50,960 --> 00:43:53,960
somebody who needs to hear what
Jesus is doing in my life.

827
00:43:53,960 --> 00:43:55,760
But I'm telling you, if you
don't want that to happen, don't

828
00:43:55,760 --> 00:43:58,520
pray because God will answer
that prayer.

829
00:43:59,120 --> 00:44:00,800
You're going to think you're
going one place, you're going to

830
00:44:00,800 --> 00:44:02,320
end up somewhere else.
You're going to be somewhere

831
00:44:02,320 --> 00:44:03,600
longer than you thought you were
going to be.

832
00:44:04,320 --> 00:44:08,320
But step one, I always, always,
always pray for that, that to be

833
00:44:08,320 --> 00:44:14,000
somebody's divine appointment.
So have your testimony ready.

834
00:44:14,280 --> 00:44:16,600
Jesus is very clear, like you
don't have to worry about what

835
00:44:16,600 --> 00:44:19,040
you're going to say, but I'm
going to give God something to

836
00:44:19,040 --> 00:44:20,560
work with.
I think the Bible, we don't have

837
00:44:20,560 --> 00:44:23,440
to worry about what we're going
to say, but I, I should at least

838
00:44:23,440 --> 00:44:26,800
know the things that God has
done in my life and the things

839
00:44:26,800 --> 00:44:30,120
God has set me free from and,
and be ready to talk about that.

840
00:44:30,640 --> 00:44:32,640
The Holy Spirit is going to give
you what you need because you're

841
00:44:32,640 --> 00:44:36,040
asking for it.
God does not want to see man go

842
00:44:36,040 --> 00:44:38,440
to hell.
And by man, I mean all of

843
00:44:38,440 --> 00:44:41,720
mankind is not what he wants.
So he's going to answer that

844
00:44:41,720 --> 00:44:45,200
prayer and then look like and
make a list like who around me

845
00:44:45,240 --> 00:44:47,960
is not saved?
There's you probably can think

846
00:44:47,960 --> 00:44:50,280
of 10 family members and five Co
workers on the top of your head

847
00:44:50,280 --> 00:44:52,240
right now.
And it's not going up there and

848
00:44:52,240 --> 00:44:53,840
being like, you know, if you
don't give out to Christ, you're

849
00:44:53,840 --> 00:44:56,440
going to hell or you better pull
the blood of Jesus right now.

850
00:44:56,440 --> 00:44:57,680
They're going to look at you
like you're nuts.

851
00:44:59,000 --> 00:45:01,280
Go take him to lunch.
Go take him to lunch.

852
00:45:01,320 --> 00:45:03,560
Go take him to coffee and buy
them over for the UFC fight.

853
00:45:04,000 --> 00:45:07,840
Go go where they are, meet them
where they are.

854
00:45:07,840 --> 00:45:11,440
You're always going somewhere.
Just make sure you take Jesus

855
00:45:11,440 --> 00:45:14,600
with you like in the forefront
of your mind because he's of

856
00:45:14,600 --> 00:45:18,000
course he's with you if you're
the Christian, but just make

857
00:45:18,000 --> 00:45:19,800
like be ready to have that ready
to go.

858
00:45:19,800 --> 00:45:22,120
Just like remember you're on
mission.

859
00:45:22,960 --> 00:45:25,680
We were on mission at the very
point of justification.

860
00:45:25,760 --> 00:45:28,280
At the very point we said yes to
Christ, we were put on mission.

861
00:45:28,840 --> 00:45:32,000
It's go time right in there.
So just live with that

862
00:45:32,000 --> 00:45:35,760
intentionality of Lord, who can
I go talk to about you today,

863
00:45:35,960 --> 00:45:38,720
man?
How can I rob hell today but

864
00:45:38,720 --> 00:45:41,640
pray those things through?
I said that's that's literally

865
00:45:41,640 --> 00:45:45,000
what I do.
Yeah, man, that's cool.

866
00:45:45,240 --> 00:45:48,160
Thanks for breaking that down in
very actionable ways.

867
00:45:48,160 --> 00:45:50,440
But the whole, you know, how can
I rob Hell today?

868
00:45:50,440 --> 00:45:52,320
That was good.
I like that one.

869
00:45:52,400 --> 00:45:53,760
I'm from the east.
I'm from the east side of

870
00:45:53,760 --> 00:45:55,320
Cleveland, bro, I'm sorry.
Sometimes it comes out.

871
00:45:56,640 --> 00:46:00,800
Man, it's all good.
Well, Eric really appreciated

872
00:46:00,800 --> 00:46:01,960
the conversation.
Man.

873
00:46:02,400 --> 00:46:05,760
Tell our listeners how they can
stay in contact with you or

874
00:46:05,760 --> 00:46:09,200
catch more of your work.
What's your contact info look

875
00:46:09,200 --> 00:46:10,920
like?
Yeah, man, I'm we are on the

876
00:46:10,920 --> 00:46:15,360
Rooting Christ podcast is on all
major podcast platforms, Apple,

877
00:46:15,360 --> 00:46:19,840
Spotify, YouTube, check it out.
We're on all I'm on all social

878
00:46:19,840 --> 00:46:23,080
media platforms.
You can find me at Eric Stevens

879
00:46:23,080 --> 00:46:27,320
1983 on Instagram.
Redwood CM, also on Instagram.

880
00:46:27,520 --> 00:46:31,480
We just created the Beyond the
Walls Movement Instagram page as

881
00:46:31,480 --> 00:46:33,040
well.
That's why it's Beyond the Walls

882
00:46:33,040 --> 00:46:34,480
Movement.
You can go follow those to stay

883
00:46:34,480 --> 00:46:36,240
up to date with everything that
we're doing.

884
00:46:36,320 --> 00:46:39,320
Don't be shocked if that concert
just happens to pop up in a city

885
00:46:39,320 --> 00:46:42,320
near you.
So yeah, if you want to, you

886
00:46:42,320 --> 00:46:45,560
want to check us out that way.
You need prayer for anything,

887
00:46:45,560 --> 00:46:46,680
hit us up.
Hit us up.

888
00:46:46,680 --> 00:46:48,640
Do not hesitate.
Sweet man.

889
00:46:48,640 --> 00:46:50,800
Well, we'll make sure there's
links so the people can do

890
00:46:50,800 --> 00:46:53,480
exactly that.
Thanks for laying out all the

891
00:46:53,480 --> 00:46:55,840
handles and the right web
addresses too.

892
00:46:56,360 --> 00:46:58,800
It's been a real pleasure, man.
Thanks for breaking a bunch of

893
00:46:58,800 --> 00:47:02,720
stuff down, letting us expose
things that needed to be able to

894
00:47:02,720 --> 00:47:05,640
be heard by the folks that are
going to listen to this.

895
00:47:05,640 --> 00:47:08,720
I'm confident that folks are
going to be blessed by it.

896
00:47:08,720 --> 00:47:11,440
Thank you for sharing your
testimony, brother.

897
00:47:12,040 --> 00:47:14,520
Aw, man, this is, it's how we
set people.

898
00:47:14,520 --> 00:47:16,760
This is how God uses us to help
set other people free.

899
00:47:16,760 --> 00:47:18,680
Man is the stuff that, that we,
that we went through.

900
00:47:18,720 --> 00:47:20,320
And it's, I think I'll say this
to anybody.

901
00:47:20,320 --> 00:47:21,920
It's important we share our
testimony.

902
00:47:22,200 --> 00:47:24,680
Let's make sure that we're not
glorifying the sin.

903
00:47:25,560 --> 00:47:28,960
You know, making sure that like,
no, because some of this stuff

904
00:47:28,960 --> 00:47:30,800
to some people can sound cool
because the life that I

905
00:47:30,800 --> 00:47:32,640
described has been glorified by
so many people.

906
00:47:32,640 --> 00:47:33,920
There's nothing glorious about
it.

907
00:47:34,760 --> 00:47:36,000
There's nothing glorious about
it.

908
00:47:36,320 --> 00:47:38,360
The glory needs to be put back
in Jesus.

909
00:47:38,800 --> 00:47:40,560
So I'm going to end it the same
way I started.

910
00:47:40,920 --> 00:47:42,240
The thing you're looking for is
Christ.

911
00:47:42,240 --> 00:47:44,920
So if you don't get anything
outside of this, I pray that you

912
00:47:44,920 --> 00:47:48,600
got closer to Christ from this
interview, from hearing a flawed

913
00:47:48,600 --> 00:47:51,000
man tell his his his story and
about his mistakes.

914
00:47:51,000 --> 00:47:52,560
I pray I brought you closer to
Jesus.

915
00:47:53,280 --> 00:48:04,280
That's the goal of everything we
try to do, Was it coincidence or

916
00:48:04,280 --> 00:48:07,640
God?
You decide for yourself, but I

917
00:48:07,640 --> 00:48:11,400
believe you just heard a story
for His glory.

918
00:48:11,920 --> 00:48:16,000
When You Look is powered by
stories just like this and yours

919
00:48:16,000 --> 00:48:20,040
could be next.
Go to whenyoulook.com/be a guest

920
00:48:20,360 --> 00:48:22,400
or use the link in the
description below.

921
00:48:22,920 --> 00:48:27,520
Be sure to drop us a like, drop
a comment or share this episode

922
00:48:27,520 --> 00:48:30,840
with somebody that needs it.
And until next time, thanks a

923
00:48:30,840 --> 00:48:33,000
bunch for listening and God
bless.